Comments on: Are The Great Commandment and The Great Commission Incompatible? http://johnshore.com/2007/05/24/are-the-great-commandment-and-the-great-commission-incompatible/ Trying God's patience since 1958 Mon, 21 May 2012 07:24:39 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v= By: Cory Griffith http://johnshore.com/2007/05/24/are-the-great-commandment-and-the-great-commission-incompatible/comment-page-2/#comment-60402 Cory Griffith Sun, 01 May 2011 17:45:34 +0000 http://johnshore.wordpress.com/2007/05/24/are-the-great-commandment-and-the-great-commission-incompatible/#comment-60402 Hi John, First, thank you for asking the question. Most people would think it is a contradiction based on the answers you have recieved. Here is what my take on your question is. If I love my neighbor like myself then I know my neighbor has a terminal condition that leads to eternal death. I have the antidote, Christ. The most loving thing I can do is build a relationship with that person so they know I care and introduce Christ through my everyday witness so eventually they want to know why I do what I do for them. In time they come to understand I care about them and that they are not just another number. Once they know I care, they begin to care about what I know. Then I introduce them to the medecine, solution to sin, that can heal them and give them eternal life versus death. If I love my neighbor I will do what it takes to help them see the need for change in their lives based on the example I set through Christ. We have the mindset that everything needs to be instantaneous based on our western culture, but 99.99% of people will never respond that way. That is why we must take the time to build relationships so they want to hear. Here is something I tell my congregation every time I have the chance. "People do not care how much you know until they know how much you care." The only way they will know how much you care is through relationship. We don't beat our neighbor down because they are living like a heathen. We build a relationship so they can see how much better life can be as a believer through our example. I hope this helps. When I came to this realization suddenly people no longer ran when they saw me coming because I stopped shoving the proverbial 10 Lb Bible down their throats and I began to care like Jesus and met their needs first. Once their needs were met they were willing to hear about Christ in an open, non-threatening way. Thanks for your post and I wish you much success in reaching those around you by loving them as you love yourself. Cory Hi John,
First, thank you for asking the question. Most people would think it is a contradiction based on the answers you have recieved. Here is what my take on your question is. If I love my neighbor like myself then I know my neighbor has a terminal condition that leads to eternal death. I have the antidote, Christ. The most loving thing I can do is build a relationship with that person so they know I care and introduce Christ through my everyday witness so eventually they want to know why I do what I do for them. In time they come to understand I care about them and that they are not just another number. Once they know I care, they begin to care about what I know. Then I introduce them to the medecine, solution to sin, that can heal them and give them eternal life versus death. If I love my neighbor I will do what it takes to help them see the need for change in their lives based on the example I set through Christ. We have the mindset that everything needs to be instantaneous based on our western culture, but 99.99% of people will never respond that way. That is why we must take the time to build relationships so they want to hear. Here is something I tell my congregation every time I have the chance. “People do not care how much you know until they know how much you care.” The only way they will know how much you care is through relationship. We don’t beat our neighbor down because they are living like a heathen. We build a relationship so they can see how much better life can be as a believer through our example. I hope this helps. When I came to this realization suddenly people no longer ran when they saw me coming because I stopped shoving the proverbial 10 Lb Bible down their throats and I began to care like Jesus and met their needs first. Once their needs were met they were willing to hear about Christ in an open, non-threatening way. Thanks for your post and I wish you much success in reaching those around you by loving them as you love yourself.

Cory

]]> By: frank sonnek http://johnshore.com/2007/05/24/are-the-great-commandment-and-the-great-commission-incompatible/comment-page-2/#comment-22257 frank sonnek Tue, 25 May 2010 06:36:03 +0000 http://johnshore.wordpress.com/2007/05/24/are-the-great-commandment-and-the-great-commission-incompatible/#comment-22257 “I love you; now change.” But is this what christians are told to tell people? The bible says that we are all spiritually dead. What is it that a dead person can do? Change that fact? So maybe the Holy Gospel is proclamation and not invitation or command? And maybe that proclamation is like God speaking "Let there be light!" Light spoken is not light that choses to be. Jesus is the bridegroom. the church is the bride. In his day, marriages were arranged. The bride did not choose the groom. Find a Lutheran church John. because you are Lutheran whether you know it or not. “I love you; now change.”

But is this what christians are told to tell people?

The bible says that we are all spiritually dead. What is it that a dead person can do? Change that fact?

So maybe the Holy Gospel is proclamation and not invitation or command?

And maybe that proclamation is like God speaking "Let there be light!" Light spoken is not light that choses to be.

Jesus is the bridegroom. the church is the bride. In his day, marriages were arranged. The bride did not choose the groom.

Find a Lutheran church John. because you are Lutheran whether you know it or not.

]]> By: Dennis Clough http://johnshore.com/2007/05/24/are-the-great-commandment-and-the-great-commission-incompatible/comment-page-2/#comment-17550 Dennis Clough Tue, 24 Nov 2009 22:42:42 +0000 http://johnshore.wordpress.com/2007/05/24/are-the-great-commandment-and-the-great-commission-incompatible/#comment-17550 Btw, I have found sucess in witnessing by being direct, dealing with the big issues. Asking questions with a smile works very well and trusting God to use His word is great. Definitely a learning experience every time. Questions work well ... offer a tract ... if its received the ask,"Are you interested in spiritual things? What do you think happens after we die? Do you believe in Heaven and h Hell? Where do you think you will go after you die? Why? Naturally, give time for responses and try to be brief on the street unless the person shows that they really want to continue. Do not argue or take offence. Be friendly: I spoke to a lady about the 2 dogs she was walking as I handed her a tract. She took it and started telling me about her dogs, whom she obviously loved. She mentioned that one of them had been rescued after being abandoned. She remarked that the rescued dog always seemed much more grateful than the other dog. What an opening! I told her how Jesus Christ had rescued me and how I am going to be forever grateful to Him ... Btw, I have found sucess in witnessing by being direct, dealing with the big issues. Asking questions with a smile works very well and trusting God to use His word is great. Definitely a learning experience every time. Questions work well … offer a tract … if its received the ask,"Are you interested in spiritual things? What do you think happens after we die? Do you believe in Heaven and h

Hell? Where do you think you will go after you die? Why? Naturally, give time for responses and try to be brief on the street unless the person shows that they really want to continue. Do not argue or take offence.

Be friendly: I spoke to a lady about the 2 dogs she was walking as I handed her a tract. She took it and started telling me about her dogs, whom she obviously loved. She mentioned that one of them had been rescued after being abandoned. She remarked that the rescued dog always seemed much more grateful than the other dog. What an opening! I told her how Jesus Christ had rescued me and how I am going to be forever grateful to Him …

]]> By: Dennis Clough http://johnshore.com/2007/05/24/are-the-great-commandment-and-the-great-commission-incompatible/comment-page-2/#comment-17548 Dennis Clough Tue, 24 Nov 2009 22:27:42 +0000 http://johnshore.wordpress.com/2007/05/24/are-the-great-commandment-and-the-great-commission-incompatible/#comment-17548 What if your understanding of the "greatest" commandment is wrong? I would like to say that the greatest commandment in the Bible is one that gives eternal life to the believer. "Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ and you will be saved" is far better than asking dead men to love God. Christ's answer about the "greatest" is in the context of the Ten. Do you not know that both Paul and Peter, James consenting (Acts 15, also Galatians 5) call the Law, all of it, all 10, a yoke of bondage unfit for the necks of new creatures in Christ? The Law is like an xray machine which can reveal the cancer of sin but cannot cure it. Jesus Christ is the healer who plants a new nature in forgiven sinners. This new nature is equipped to grow and be transformed into the image of Christ as it is fed the Word of God rightly divided. Oh for a return to Galatians preached and properly understood for a surge of truth and power through out the church of the Living God! Christ fullfilled the Law; both it's righteous requirements and its death penalty for every Law breaker. There is no Gospel but this Gospel and only Gospel believers will go to Heaven having been born again down here. That's a message worth sharing! It is entirely possible to be saved and afterwards add requirements to grace, thus polluting grace and making it largely inoperative in the present earthly life of the believer. That is what Paul was dealing with in Galatians. He said that little leaven (that's rotted dough, btw) leaven's the whole lump. We are to get rid of any teaching that contradicts the promises of grace in even the weakest believer's life. God bless, Dennis What if your understanding of the "greatest" commandment is wrong? I would like to say that the greatest commandment in the Bible is one that gives eternal life to the believer. "Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ and you will be saved" is far better than asking dead men to love God.

Christ's answer about the "greatest" is in the context of the Ten. Do you not know that both Paul and Peter, James consenting (Acts 15, also Galatians 5) call the Law, all of it, all 10, a yoke of bondage unfit for the necks of new creatures in Christ?

The Law is like an xray machine which can reveal the cancer of sin but cannot cure it. Jesus Christ is the healer who plants a new nature in forgiven sinners. This new nature is equipped to grow and be transformed into the image of Christ as it is fed the Word of God rightly divided.

Oh for a return to Galatians preached and properly understood for a surge of truth and power through out the church of the Living God! Christ fullfilled the Law; both it's righteous requirements and its death penalty for every Law breaker. There is no Gospel but this Gospel and only Gospel believers will go to Heaven having been born again down here. That's a message worth sharing!

It is entirely possible to be saved and afterwards add requirements to grace, thus polluting grace and making it largely inoperative in the present earthly life of the believer.

That is what Paul was dealing with in Galatians. He said that little leaven (that's rotted dough, btw) leaven's the whole lump. We are to get rid of any teaching that contradicts the promises of grace in even the weakest believer's life. God bless, Dennis

]]> By: LDS & Evangelical Conversations http://johnshore.com/2007/05/24/are-the-great-commandment-and-the-great-commission-incompatible/comment-page-2/#comment-14316 LDS & Evangelical Conversations Fri, 12 Jun 2009 18:32:28 +0000 http://johnshore.wordpress.com/2007/05/24/are-the-great-commandment-and-the-great-commission-incompatible/#comment-14316 <strong>Are Evangelicals Really Christians?...</strong> Forgive the provocative title. Reading through the Gospels has put a lot of questions in my mind about what it means to be a disciple of Christ. Jesus is quoted as giving some pretty direct statements regarding who would be his true followers and be pa... Are Evangelicals Really Christians?…

Forgive the provocative title.
Reading through the Gospels has put a lot of questions in my mind about what it means to be a disciple of Christ. Jesus is quoted as giving some pretty direct statements regarding who would be his true followers and be pa…

]]> By: daniel http://johnshore.com/2007/05/24/are-the-great-commandment-and-the-great-commission-incompatible/comment-page-2/#comment-11300 daniel Wed, 14 Jan 2009 11:43:04 +0000 http://johnshore.wordpress.com/2007/05/24/are-the-great-commandment-and-the-great-commission-incompatible/#comment-11300 John, I think that as christians we've omitted parts of the great commission. The greatest commandment though remains what it is. The thing with the great commission is that it is the "sharing the gospel with nonbelievers". But we often forget what the gospel, which means good news, is in this context. Yes, it is the gospel of salvation that says "we are all sinners and we are doomed to burn in hell, but jesus christ paid the price in our place, so that if we believe in him, our sins are forgiven and we can now go to heaven". What we often forget though, is that there's also the gospel that the kingdom of god is right here on earth or "at hand". What I mean is that in the context of "sharing" my faith with unbelievers, it is the kingdom of god shining through from the inside out that people around us notice and want to know "hey, you're different. why?". Or showing kindness to someone who didn't expect it and then wonders why we do what we do. So it is first the kingdom inside of us that is demonstrated. And then it is communicating the gospel of the kingdom, that this kingdom can also be inside of the unbeliever because of the gospel of salvation. Now, here's the tricky thing: the great commission can only be fulfilled by fulfilling the great commandment. They MUST go hand in hand, or none of them can be effective. (Otherwise the great commission becomes the great omission - see i told you i keep finding the funnies in everything!) John, I think that as christians we've omitted parts of the great commission. The greatest commandment though remains what it is. The thing with the great commission is that it is the "sharing the gospel with nonbelievers". But we often forget what the gospel, which means good news, is in this context.

Yes, it is the gospel of salvation that says "we are all sinners and we are doomed to burn in hell, but jesus christ paid the price in our place, so that if we believe in him, our sins are forgiven and we can now go to heaven". What we often forget though, is that there's also the gospel that the kingdom of god is right here on earth or "at hand". What I mean is that in the context of "sharing" my faith with unbelievers, it is the kingdom of god shining through from the inside out that people around us notice and want to know "hey, you're different. why?". Or showing kindness to someone

who didn't expect it and then wonders why we do what we do.

So it is first the kingdom inside of us that is demonstrated. And then it is communicating the gospel of the kingdom, that this kingdom can also be inside of the unbeliever because of the gospel of salvation.

Now, here's the tricky thing: the great commission can only be fulfilled by fulfilling the great commandment. They MUST go hand in hand, or none of them can be effective. (Otherwise the great commission becomes the great omission – see i told you i keep finding the funnies in everything!)

]]> By: Calvin http://johnshore.com/2007/05/24/are-the-great-commandment-and-the-great-commission-incompatible/comment-page-2/#comment-7930 Calvin Sat, 26 Jul 2008 08:20:14 +0000 http://johnshore.wordpress.com/2007/05/24/are-the-great-commandment-and-the-great-commission-incompatible/#comment-7930 The great commandment and commission are not contradictory? Loving ones neighbor as one loves himself is the principle motivation behing sharing the gospel (the kingdom of God) the great commission. The kingdom of God first needs to be understood by believers before they can go out to share the "good news" with unbelievers. Christianity gets hung up on the physical cost of what Jesus did at the cross, however, he died to restore the kingdom of God back to man which was lost in the garden. Adam lost dominion over his circumstances in the garden and every man (plural term) on planet earth is seeking to have this restored in his life. Not religion, not New Age, or any world system, but the gospel (the kingdom of God). The great commandment and commission are not contradictory? Loving ones neighbor as one loves himself is the principle motivation behing sharing the gospel (the kingdom of God) the great commission. The kingdom of God first needs to be understood by believers before they can go out to share the "good news" with unbelievers. Christianity gets hung up on the physical cost of what Jesus did at the cross, however, he died to restore the kingdom of God back to man which was lost in the garden. Adam lost dominion over his circumstances in the garden and every man (plural term) on planet earth is seeking to have this restored in his life. Not religion, not New Age, or any world system, but the gospel (the kingdom of God).

]]> By: Mark http://johnshore.com/2007/05/24/are-the-great-commandment-and-the-great-commission-incompatible/comment-page-2/#comment-6095 Mark Mon, 21 Apr 2008 05:23:50 +0000 http://johnshore.wordpress.com/2007/05/24/are-the-great-commandment-and-the-great-commission-incompatible/#comment-6095 I am sorry if my comments are repeating those of others I am not very familiar to your writing or work but i just read your post "Are The Great Commandment and The Great Commission Incompatible?" And thought I would a my thoughts. I am a follower of Jesus Christ and have been for the last 17 years. I am recently moved to India to share the message of Christ's redemption with those that haven't heard here. I find the concept that the The Great Commandment and The Great Commission could be Incompatible to be quite absurd, however do see how some could misunderstand the the two to be in a sort of conflict. SO.. a few quick points 1) I don't think the gospel message -the heart of what the great commission is- says "I am ok, you're not" I think it says "WE are not ok." and HE is the way to redemption. Rom 3:23, 5:12 2) I don't think the great commandment SAYS so much "I love you with all of my heart." I think that it shows that love in a way that is often misunderstood. This idea -doing a loving thing that you don't understand- goes into many parts of our lives. A few examples are: a)As a parent you discipline your children for various reasons and often they respond with feeling and actions that are clear that they don't feel loved but they feel chastised. b)friends and family may sometimes intervene into someones life when they are enjoying the destructive things in life -ie. drug additions- those being intervened upon don't always feel loved but may respond with feelings and thoughts that those intervening are arrogant and judgmental. c)Often the a state's department for children's welfare will intervene a remove a child from the parents custody, to help both the parent and the child. Without getting into the semantics of each of my examples these are a few examples of doing loving things that when done are not seen or heard as loving. We as believers are commanded to love our neighbors AND to tell them the gospel. I believe these two are in fact the same. Sharing the redemptive love of Christ starts with understanding why you need to be redeemed -our sin-. Bringing people to an understanding of why they need to be redeemed in order for them to come into relationship with a infinitely good and perfect God, IS the best way to love your neighbor as yourself. Mark I am sorry if my comments are repeating those of others I am not very familiar to your writing or work but i just read your post "Are The Great Commandment and The Great Commission Incompatible?" And thought I would a my thoughts.

I am a follower of Jesus Christ and have been for the last 17 years. I am recently moved to India to share the message of Christ's redemption with those that haven't heard here.

I find the concept that the The Great Commandment and The Great Commission could be Incompatible to be quite absurd, however do see how some could misunderstand the the two to be in a sort of conflict.

SO.. a few quick points

1)

I don't think the gospel message -the heart of what the great commission is- says "I am ok, you're not" I think it says "WE are not ok." and HE is the way to redemption.

Rom 3:23, 5:12

2)

I don't think the great commandment SAYS so much "I love you with all of my heart." I think that it shows that love in a way that is often misunderstood. This idea -doing a loving thing that you don't understand- goes into many parts of our lives.

A few examples are:

a)As a parent you discipline your children for various reasons and often they respond with feeling and actions that are clear that they don't feel loved but they feel chastised.

b)friends and family may sometimes intervene into someones life when they are enjoying the destructive things in life -ie. drug additions- those being intervened upon don't always feel loved but may respond with feelings and thoughts that those intervening are arrogant and judgmental.

c)Often the a state's department for children's welfare will intervene a remove a child from the parents custody, to help both the parent and the child.

Without getting into the semantics of each of my examples these are a few examples of doing loving things that when done are not seen or heard as loving.

We as believers are commanded to love our neighbors AND to tell them the gospel. I believe these two are in fact the same. Sharing the redemptive love of Christ starts with understanding why you need to be redeemed -our sin-. Bringing people to an understanding of why they need to be redeemed in order for them to come into relationship with a infinitely good and perfect God, IS the best way to love your neighbor as yourself.

Mark

]]> By: What the Atheists Taught Me « Suddenly Christian http://johnshore.com/2007/05/24/are-the-great-commandment-and-the-great-commission-incompatible/comment-page-2/#comment-938 What the Atheists Taught Me « Suddenly Christian Mon, 17 Sep 2007 12:54:14 +0000 http://johnshore.wordpress.com/2007/05/24/are-the-great-commandment-and-the-great-commission-incompatible/#comment-938 [...] posts: “Are The Great Commandment and the Great Commission Incompatible?”,  “More on The Great Commandment vs. The Great Commission” , “To My Recent [...] [...] posts: “Are The Great Commandment and the Great Commission Incompatible?”,  “More on The Great Commandment vs. The Great Commission” , “To My Recent [...]

]]> By: William http://johnshore.com/2007/05/24/are-the-great-commandment-and-the-great-commission-incompatible/comment-page-2/#comment-688 William Sat, 01 Sep 2007 21:05:53 +0000 http://johnshore.wordpress.com/2007/05/24/are-the-great-commandment-and-the-great-commission-incompatible/#comment-688 Wow. I am amazed to hear such words from a practicing Christian! I am an atheist and I am constantly bombarded with wanna be evangelists offering to "pray for me" or 'talk about my soul" and other strange nonsense. I work at a restaurant as a waiter and people even leave me tracts with my tip! Why would anyone do such a thing? It is very hard for me to understand because I have been an atheist since I was 13 years old (I am now 25). I have never known a serious Christian who talks about toning down the preaching. This very same "morally superior" attitude is what keeps me from being able to maintain friendships with any religious folks at all. All of the people who I can stand being around are atheist, agnostic or pagan. If more religious folks thought like you, then maybe they would have less "militant atheists" to worry about. I will not be converted and you will not be converted so why can we not be friends? Oh, well. You are in the minority so I guess things will not change anytime soon. I am going to buy your book from amazon to see what all you have to say. Your message seems pretty positive to me and your fellows should listen closely. Wow. I am amazed to hear such words from a practicing Christian! I am an atheist and I am constantly bombarded with wanna be evangelists offering to “pray for me” or ‘talk about my soul” and other strange nonsense. I work at a restaurant as a waiter and people even leave me tracts with my tip! Why would anyone do such a thing?

It is very hard for me to understand because I have been an atheist since I was 13 years old (I am now 25). I have never known a serious Christian who talks about toning down the preaching.

This very same “morally superior” attitude is what keeps me from being able to maintain friendships with any religious folks at all. All of the people who I can stand being around are atheist, agnostic or pagan. If more religious folks thought like you, then maybe they would have less “militant atheists” to worry about.

I will not be converted and you will not be converted so why can we not be friends? Oh, well. You are in the minority so I guess things will not change anytime soon.

I am going to buy your book from amazon to see what all you have to say. Your message seems pretty positive to me and your fellows should listen closely.

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