It’s a fact that gay teenagers are about thirty percent more likely than straight teenagers to take their own lives.
It’s a fact that the vast majority of Christians believe that being gay is a profound moral failing, a foul aberration, a repelling, unnatural offense against God that fully warrants as punishment an eternity spent in hell.
Asserting that those two facts have no relationship cannot possibly be anything but intellectually dishonest. It’s like someone who sews robes for the Klan asserting that they personally don’t contribute to the harming of African Americans.
I love being Christian; I am forever humbled by what God as Christ did for humankind on the cross; I understand and experience the Bible as divinely inspirational. I pray every morning. Contemplating the majesty and mercy of God is part of my everyday life.
So what? That has zero to do with the fact that gay teens are thirty percent more likely than straight teens to shoot themselves in the head, to let their blood flow out until they’re white, to hang themselves from their neck until they stop twitching. Nor has it anything to do with the fact that the vast majority of Christians passionately hold that living as a gay person is a contemptible disgrace to God, and a blatant, willful offense against everything that’s decent and honorable.
We Christians can say that we’re only trying to follow God. We can say that we personally would never do anything to hurt a gay person. We can say that we love the sinner, but hate their sin. We can say anything.
But let’s not insult ourselves and anyone listening to us by saying that we don’t understand the relationship between the gay teen suicide rate, and the common, absolute Christian condemnation of gays. We deserve better than that.
God knows LGBT folk do.
Please watch this till the end:
![John Shore on The Huffington Post](http://johnshore.files.wordpress.com/2010/03/huffpost.jpg?w=120 "John Shore on The Huffington Post\")
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All I have to say is, “Judge not, lest ye be judged.” If you could walk a mile in the shoes of these teens, you might be singing a different tune.
Exactly how Christian believers demonize any person who doesn’t give credence to the holy bible is something that can’t be disregarded or caused by misunderstandings. This has happened for much more time than it hasn’t (See christian crimes against humankind). If you explore those “purifying” strategies, you will get an idea of how man-made insight digested as supernatural can be quickly misinterpreted by anybody for any reason. Communities and persons.
lets face it the action and sin is wrong in gods eyes but that gives no man the right to judge and persecute. you are not god and you shouldnt try to play god u are simply a man and you should leave you nose out of gods business.
anthony, you must be new here…. please take a few moments to read John’s essay about why we can say that the Bible does NOT condemn homosexuality. Then perhaps you might come to understand that the ‘action’ that IS condemned in the Bible is the exploitative use and abuse of people in idolatrous and culturally (ancient Greece and Rome) accepted behavior that had nothing to do with mutually loving and honoring committed relationships.
Thank you, vj.
2 things i said today before i ever saw this…
1 – i believe that in silence we condone something even if we disagree with it. those who are treated cruelly, heartlessly, hatefully, need to hear every single christian voice willing to speak up and speak out in love, support and acceptance of the love of God and Christ for each and every person God made, straight, gay, sideways, or any other way. God made us all exactly as we are, and loves us all with the same miraculous, all-encompassing grace we have been promised.
2 – i sometimes picture Jesus weeping for the things His children are taught to believe in His name.
Amen, my friend! I think the church has done such horrible things to people in the name of “God’s truth” that it deeply grieves the heart of God. Rob Bell and Don Golden wrote a book entitled “Jesus Wants To Save Christians”, and in it they describe differences between what Christians do, and the believe they (Bell & Golden) have about who Christ is.
Jesus once said to me “I never meant to start another religion. I just want to restore people.” if the church is the bride of Christ, it is running perilously close to running out of oil. But the miracle of the true good news is that it works in and through imperfect people. Thank God for Saving Christians like Rob Bell, Don Golden, John Shore, and the countless people who “get it”.
You have got to be kidding me. Get over yourselves. Wow, way to be diverse. Stop living in your dystopian bubble. You are so blind to the current picture. ou live once and this is how you live it? HATING OTHERS THAT ARE AS HARMLESS AS THE MEANING ITSELF. You contradict what you think Humanity is. Love and peace to everyone – enough said.
I AM THE WAY THE TRUTH AND THE LIFE AND HE THAT COMETH TO ME I WILL IN NO WISE CAST OUT. COME TO ME ALL YE THAT ARE HEAVY LADEN AND I WILL GIVE YOU REST.
God Said Be Ye Holy For I am Holy. And Being “Gay” Is Not Holy
God Made Note To It In The Old Testament
You Are So Right Brother
Strider and Mack: Do you think I can’t tell from your IP address that you’re the same person? Jesus. Lame much?
Hearing the word of God is not to blame as to why people kill themselves. Suicide is the work of the devil. Sin is sin for a reason. HE would not call it an abomination for nothing. God sent his word to save us, not hurt us. Don’t take it likely that gay teens commit suicide at such high rates or that the lifespan of gays is significantly(20+ years!!) shorter overall. You are referring to the preaching of the Gospel as condemnation when in reality the word of God is the only thing that will save them!
So, being taught that a major factor in one’s life (who one is attracted to) which one has NO control over is ‘intrinsically disordered’ (the Pope said that one), an “abomination” in the eyes of God worthy of DEATH (your holy book), a worse threat to humanity than environmental destruction (the Pope again), and a worse threat to America than terrorism (a number of preachers and politicians have made that statement) is what, good for the psyche of young people? Every teenager who kills himself because of condemnation from the people who should be supporting him is YOUR fault. YOU with this statement might as well have shot him yourself.
Step out of your denial and wake up. These kids commit suicide largely in part because people like you who call them unfit and unholy and you make them feel like they won’t ever be able to have a relationship with God if they don’t change who they are. It’s spiritual abuse and the only abomination in the room is you. Christianity is beginning to wake up to the horrifying way we’ve abused gay and lesbian children, there is blood on our collective hands. This isn’t God’s fault – this isn’t the Bible’s fault. It’s your fault for taking small piece of it and twisting it to say isolated and in power and it’s my fault for letting you do that in silence for so long. Not anymore.
In short? Wake up, accept responsibility for how we’ve damaged this community and alienated them from Jesus or get out of my church.
You Are So Right We Should Not Be Mean To Them But
We Need To Share The Word
Learn to use correct grammar and punctuation, and maybe people will take you a little more seriously. Either way, I stand with these teens, and I stand by John’s opinion: People like you are the reason these suicides are happening. Shame on you for using the Bible to promote prejudice and hate.
Religion is idiotic.
Whereas that proclamation is clearly genius.
Not Beliveing Is Stupid
im a christain, one of my best friends is gay. I would never do anything to emotionaly hurt him because of that. Yes i have told him my views, but thats beside the point. His parents are christians, and they hate him, whats the difference betwwen me and them? Im following the part of the bible that says “Love thy neighbor.” weather hes right or wrong isnt my place to say. and it isnt anyone else’s eather.
You Are Right His Parents Should Not Treat Him That
And We Should Be Nice To Them But It Is Wrong
people who commit the sin of suicide have deeper issues then just being gay… it is a selfish, heartless act… void of love for anyone outside of self… that is the fact… not that a person is gay or straight…
I can only hope that the “Rev” you’ve used in your screen name isn’t short for “reverend.”
Reviler, perhaps? Revolting?
Just another no-name who wants to be perceived as an authority on God and love…I mean hate and um, opposite of God.
This doesn’t even make sense. People in despair do stupid things. The point is the DESPAIR.
I really need to get 8 hours of sleep before I come to this site, the ignorant, thoughtless comments offered in the name of Jesus get on my last nerve when I don’t.
Well.
One hopes you are not in the business of providing emotional support. To anyone.
Wow. Talk about selfish and heartless . . . . you really haven’t got a clue about depression, do you?
Rev-If you’ve lost someone to suicide, I am so sorry. Your sentiment may be based on the deep hurt you have felt, and are possibly still feeling. My hope is that one day you will be able to come to terms with it, forgive, and consider that your current perceptions are not reflective of the majority of sucides.
If you have not experienced such a heart-wrenching experience, then your comment is meaningless, unfounded and is simply an ill-conceived opinion. Unless you can substantiate your claims to be “fact” then I strongly recommend that you revisit the issue.
A 13-year old who hangs himself is not heartless, but heart-broken. How dare you minimize this child’s pain, his character. How dare you use your words to make grieving parents hurt even more.
parents and the memory which that lives in the hearsts of his family.
his character and mental state into an absolute certaintyhis chacater and mental state . The dead parents’ of this child have enough grief with which they are contending.
Susan, you are so right on the point. Unless you’ve had a family member or friend who’s taken their life you’d never know the experience and pain. I had a friend in elementary school (almost 20 years ago) who was obviously gay, very feminiate, and in high school took his life.
I remember him being teased, bullied, and abused by classmates. He came from a good home, good parents, he never “chose to be gay”, he didn’t choose to be abused! It hurts to know he was so damaged that he felt he had no other way out.
I’m openly gay, work in film/entertainment with Christain parents and siblings who love, support and accept me unconditionally. I won’t hide my light under a bushel or in my closet when there are countless who feel trapped. If I could turn back time I’d tell him, my friend (Nathan) how much God loves him, that he is uniquely preciously made by God.
Thank you John for writing this blog it is so true. Us(as christians) tend to have so many derogatory words to say about the gay and lesbian lifestyle instead of trying to assist them in finding the right life style. Christians like to point out the it is a sin to live this lifestyle and that gays peopel are going to hell for living the life that they live but I think we forget that by condeming them to hell we are also condeming ourselves….The religious stand point on this situation is the reason so many people have so many negative things to say about homosexuality and it is passed on to the children which is then passed on the that poor kid who is still trying to find him/herself, that kid who doesn’t fully understand the feeling that they have, instead of finding comfort and direction they find humiliation and more confusion…
And for anyone looking for an 'honest' discussion on this topic:
http://tinyurl.com/28eby3a
jason
If by “honest” you mean “defensive, passive-aggressive, inconsistent, illogical, disobedient and rooted in spiritual victimhood” then I agree. Thank you for clearing that up!
Jason, Mr. Mohler paints far too many Biblical assertions as “facts” for it to be an open and honest discussion. He dismisses actual truths as opinions.
He may be well-intentioned, but his may well be the most dangerous brand of Christianity – because of this: “Was there no believer to befriend Tyler and, without loving his homosexuality, love him? The homosexual community insists that to love someone is to love their sexual orientation. We know this to be a lie. But no one who loves me should love nor rationalize my sin. The church must be the people who speak honestly about sin because we have first learned by God’s grace to speak honestly of our own.”
He continues to perpetuate the “love the sinner, hate the sin” myth. Which relies entirely on homosexuality being a sin, which can only be possible if it is a choice. Since it is not, well, his argument falls apart pretty quickly. He discusses it as if no one has ever questioned the translations that ultimately wound up in the Bible. He discusses the Bible as if it is a single series of hard, cold facts.
Homosexuality is a state of being. To love a gay person is to accept that, and honor the entirety of who that person is – not ask him or her to spend their lives denying their very core. Not ask that they deny themselves the quest for love, for a soulmate and life partner. You can love someone and hate that they swear. You can love someone and hate that they sometimes lie. You can love someone and forgive their mistakes. You cannot love someone and hate who they ARE.
Mr. Mohler is discussing homosexuality as if he truly understands it, as if he is an expert on it – when, in fact, all he is doing is making the exact problem he professes breaks his heart all that much worse.
He is doing the one thing we need people to STOP doing – giving conservative Christians justification for their bigotry.
Exactly. Thank you, Mindy.
Jaon, it’s very easy to agree with such pronouncements when they dehumanize individuals and categorize them as a “they” – and make sweeping generalizations about them. “They” have names: Carl Walker Hoover, 11, hanged himself, Jaheem Herrera, 11, hanged himself, Justin Aaberg, 15, hanged himself, Billy Lucas, 15, hanged himself….. So tell me, if you ran into Carl or Jaheem…how would it be possible for you to condemn them, yet love them at the same time? Don’t use the “hate the sin, love the sinner” – sins are choices, homosexuality is like being left or right-handed., having blue eyes or red hair. It’s like being born a heterosexual…or do you recall choosing that orientation?
Here’s a good video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U8J93a2IES4&feature=sub
I'm new to this blog, and I recently commented on the e-mail John was asked to post. I looked over at the "recent comments" section, and saw that many people were commenting on this post. I decided to read it as well. I have to say that a lot of drama seems to surround comments like the one I'm about to make, but please take it knowing it is coming from a good place. I just want to say that I am the minority when it comes to this topic, on this blog. I don't believe that Christians who disagree with homosexuality are responsible in any way, for teen suicide among the gay community. Some people, Christian or not, are responsible for making them feel so desperate. But to paint with such a broad brush and say that all Christians who believe it is wrong are somewhat responsible, is false. IMHO.
Thanks for your comment. It is 100% wrong. If you decide to actually listen to those who tried to commit suicide instead of what you want to believe about Christians, then you’ll see that you’re wrong.
John,
I just wanted to say thank you for highlighting this and making noise about it in the Christian community. In my work with Truth Wins Out, a nonprofit dedicated to fighting back against the lies that are spread about gays and gay teens, primarily by the Religious Right, it can be difficult to both respond forcefully and also with a voice that will reach readers such as yours, so we are ever grateful to other people who can find a voice of these issues in their own communities. Keep up the good work.
Evan Hurst
Social Media Director
Truth Wins Out
Exactly, Ace – it is the obsession piece that freaks me out. I'd be scared to pieces if I were this kid.
Altho' on the kid's behalf, he sounds pretty awesome.
Yea, he seems to be really smart. I can see why he was voted for by the other students.
He seems to be handling himself admirably. I just hope the powers that be take this nutcase seriously and don't try to protect him. It's hard to get justice in cases like these because of people's prejudices, but I'm hoping common sense wins out over jackassery for once.
Michigan ASSISTANT ATTORNEY GENERAL is cyber-bullying a gay college student openly in the name of Jesus.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PwObjKZg9Jw&fe…!
The blog: http://chris-armstrong-watch.blogspot.com/
Wow. There's that 'radical gay agenda' in action: keeping the cafeteria open longer and lowering tuition and lifting gender rules on student housing. The fact that Armstrong was elected on just these issues and represents the majority view of electors without reducing any one's rights seems to be lost on the bigot in his rush to frame Armstrong and anything he does as a gay radicalism.
Note that the AAG identifies himself as a christian citizen, as if that designation elevates his mental illness to acceptable standards.
This is what I'm talking about. Done with it.
Yea, I saw that this morning. This guy is involved with those Westboro Baptist Church lunatics though, mind you. A real whackadoodle.
He also calls the student a "nazi" thereby invoking Godwin's Law and pretty well shooting any of his "arguments" out of the water immediately.
I would sincerely hope that this man is removed from his job as assistant attorney general as a result of this insanity he has splattered over the internet.
I read the Attorney General has looked into disciplinary or employment termination, but may be limited because of First Amendment obstacles. The wacko I think tries to be careful to make it "clear" that he's speaking on his own behalf, not the State, but…really, c'mon.
Of course, the Attorney General might just be paying lip service to the national outrage, but really has no intention to do anything anyway.
Some of his statements, such as accusing the student of underage drinking at a party he was not even present at (or even in the same city as), could count as slander/libel. I'm not lawyer so I don't know all the laws in that regard but putting in print verifiable lies is usually not covered under the 1st amendment.
Anderson did say in the video that the student declined to be interviewed because he is pursuing legal action against this loon. Regardless – this is hate speech, pure and simple, and the fact that the state is employing someone who publicly engaged in it on an international platform is reprehensible.
No, it's not protected speech, you are correct. The Attorney General says he's looking into it. One possibility would be to discipline or terminate him for violating some office code of conduct. And you're right, he could be sued for defamation. Might be one of the best ways to deal with him–sue his sorry a**.
Oh. My. God. If I were a resident of the state of Michigan, I would be out of my mind that my tax dollars are paying the salary of this hateful, deranged lunatic.
I would also not be at all surprised to find out that underneath it all, he is, in fact, gay – and a lifetime of utter self-loathing has turned him into a complete nutjob.
He certainly fits the profile. It's not just a detached "gay people are bad mmkay" but rather an maniacal obsession with this student. You don't drum up feelings that intense over something for no reason.
If he weren't so dangerous (due to his position) I'd almost feel sorry for him. Almost.
As it is, he needs to get gone, fast.
Jesus gave us two great commandments and the second is this: love your neighbor as yourself. He didn't say, "love your heterosexual neighbor:" he said: love your neighbor. Whomever that might be.
Judging, condemning, excluding, rejecting, and oppressing is not loving.
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